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Biosphere
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Joined: 08 Oct 2006
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Location: Der Schweiz

PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 8:25 am    Post subject:  Reply with quote

I'm not so motivated to engage today after the events in Nice and thinking that it's possibly just a matter of time before there is an attack on a cycle race.

Bart you seem to have moved on from describing it as a racing incident (which I disagreed with) to it being the responsibility of the race organiser which is about where I was. I don't think that Buongiorno was left with an unfair outcome, is justification for Froome and Porte to be treated in the same way. As I said yesterday the this was too high profile (picture of jogging Froome above the fold on the papers at the train station this morning), for cycling to be so blinkered as to go down it's usual masochistic rules is rules route and I am glad.

As for the rule that the race must be completed entirely by bike, the Inner Ring post linked above points out that the spirit of that rule is about jumping on a train and so on. Again it was a common sense decision.
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SlowRower



Joined: 22 Nov 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 8:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bio - Agree re Nice. Awful.

But on a lighter note, I was actually very impressed with Froome's running form. Running uphill, on cleats, in inflexible shoes or after a long bike ride are hard enough in isolation. To look so smooth when combining all 4 is quite a skill!
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Biosphere
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 8:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wouldn't say he looked smooth, but I was impressed he managed to stay upright and not slip.

On the subject of cleats, I wonder if it's not time to review exactly what the neutral service should be carrying. A bit pointless if it can't support the race leader.
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Biosphere
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 8:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I hadn't seen this after Stage 11, but the impact on Movistar was clearly more than 12s.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/q...rganisers-for-dangerous-stage-11/


Last edited by Biosphere on Fri Jul 15, 2016 9:40 am; edited 1 time in total
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SlowRower



Joined: 22 Nov 2006
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Location: 62 West Wallaby Street, Wigan

PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 9:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Biosphere wrote:
I wouldn't say he looked smooth...


Well he's not Mo Farah, but compared to even quite decent "Weekend Warrior" triathletes he looked pretty good.

Biosphere wrote:
On the subject of cleats, I wonder if it's not time to review exactly what the neutral service should be carrying. A bit pointless if it can't support the race leader.


Google suggests Froome has Shimano pedals. Maybe the Mavic car only has bikes with Mavic pedals - which few/none of the pros ride!
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HuwB



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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 9:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In other news, Thibaut Pinot has quit the Tour.
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SlowRower



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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 9:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This made me laugh...

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mazda



Joined: 02 May 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 9:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Biosphere wrote:
I hadn't seen this after Stage 11, but the impact on Movistar was clearly more than 12s.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/q...rganisers-for-dangerous-stage-11/


I can't accept that point of view.
Riding through "too many villages".
Ridiculous.
It's not the route that is dangerous, it is the way the teams ride.

JA Flecha seemed convinced that Quintana would show the effects of all the riding in the wind on today's ITT.


Last edited by mazda on Fri Jul 15, 2016 10:06 am; edited 1 time in total
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Biosphere
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 9:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

HuwB wrote:
In other news, Thibaut Pinot has quit the Tour.


But for reasons that are still unknown?
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mazda



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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 10:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

By breakfast everything seems clearer.
Times were taken from 1,200m to go.

A bit of criticism for Froome for "forcing" a peloton go-slow by taking a comfort break after the Gerrans / Sky crash.
Noble thing to do, probably, but a large slice of self interest and no doubt stretching even the spirit of the non-written rules.
Plus, as observed at the time it had a dramatic effect on the race with the second larger peloton catching the main GC peloton.

Finally, if you say that a rider has to have a bike at all time then where do you draw the line ?
Say a rider falls and walks 10m up the road and is given a new bike.
The rule is not to prevent riders from walking / running along the road for a "short" distance.
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HuwB



Joined: 17 May 2007
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Location: Deep in the Black Mountains.

PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 10:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Oh dear, still more controversy.
Watch closely.
I am awaiting another explosion of BF outrage and this time, imo, it's well justified:-

https://twitter.com/assekevin/status/753720450551836673
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SlowRower



Joined: 22 Nov 2006
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Location: 62 West Wallaby Street, Wigan

PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 10:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

HuwB wrote:
Oh dear, still more controversy.
Watch closely.
I am awaiting another explosion of BF outrage and this time, imo, it's well justified:-

https://twitter.com/assekevin/status/753720450551836673


Sticky wheels. Whatever next? Smile
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Biosphere
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 12:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Theuns has crashed and is being taken to hospital.
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mazda



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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 12:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I take it the wind is still a factor today ?

With 70 riders home Oliveira (MOV) leads.
Ahead of luminaries such as Dennis and Cancellara.
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HuwB



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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 12:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mazda wrote:
I take it the wind is still a factor today ?

With 70 riders home Oliveira (MOV) leads.
Ahead of luminaries such as Dennis and Cancellara.


Sure is, seeing most of the route runs from East to West:-



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HuwB



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Location: Deep in the Black Mountains.

PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 12:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Current:-

1. Nelson Oliveira, 51.56
2. Rohan Dennis, at 0.10
3. Stephen Cummings, at 0.53
4. Maciej Bodnar, at 1.01
5. Fabian Cancellara, at 1.44

It's tailwind, crosswind, crosswind, then 50kph (gusting to 70kph) at the finish.

Quintana will be needing that neutral service bike again. Smile
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mazda



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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 1:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Coppel slides into second, after leading at the bottom of the final climb.
Tony Martin setting off.
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Fontfroide



Joined: 07 Apr 2008
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Location: Herault, France

PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 1:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So teams use four kinds of pedals (in the official bike information).  We have no idea if all the riders use the pedals they are meant to.  I might add that Froome is 1.86 m tall.  Some teams don't even have ONE rider that tall.

Shimano 10 (including Sky)
Look Keo Blade  9
Speedplay  2
Garmin Vector 2  1 team, guess which.

It is clearly impossible for the neutral service car to have the frame sizes and pedal choices of all the riders.  Hence the yellow bike tragi-comedy.  In fact, one wonders if the neutral service car is useful for most riders.
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Fontfroide



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Location: Herault, France

PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 1:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

HuwB wrote:
Oh dear, still more controversy.
Watch closely.
I am awaiting another explosion of BF outrage and this time, imo, it's well justified:-

https://twitter.com/assekevin/status/753720450551836673


Hard to cheat and remain unseen these days.  Given all that, I still wonder if we have a shot or video from the front of the crash showing why exactly the moto stopped so suddenly.  I do like the shot someone posted from above, showing the way forward.  THICKLY packed crowd!

I am missing a lot of this discussion.  I think the commissars did exactly the right thing so far.  Depriving Froome of the jersey because of the crowd and a motorcycle seems a bit harsh.

On the other hand, let's suppose the crowd did not part at the last second, as it seems to almost always do.  1400 metres to the end, or whatever. NO motorcycle immediately ahead.  So Porte crashes, the others go down, a motorcycle from the rear runs over Froome's bike.  The other two get up and ride off.  On a flat stage, no doubt what would happen with the times.

And the rules seem pretty clear actually.  Whatever the Giro did in the case of Biongorno.  The Giro is not the Tour.  I expect the rules might even be a wee bit different.
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gerry12ie



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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 1:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I managed to watch the race when I got in from work yesterday evening then promptly dozed off and woke up at 6am, so missed all the fun of the internet last night!  It seems to me that the commissaires took the most rational route to a decision, although I am very mindful of Bauke's tweet that wondered what would have happened if he were the only one taken out.  In fairness, there were only two viable options - the decision they eventually reached, or letting the original times stand.

It was quite shocking to watch it unfold, and was surely an accident waiting to happen.  The mountain crowds seem to more compressed, more boisterous, and more dangerous year on year.  For me, I find it all a bit uncomfortable watching the TDF big climbs as I am almost expecting something like that to happen.  I could think of a couple of million things I would like to do more than hang around on the side of a mountain for hours on end getting pissed and acting like a muppet while dressed in a mankini, but it seems to work for plenty.  Sadly, I expect more of this before there is some action taken.

My initial thoughts were that the moto seized from the shock of seeing Porte attack Froome Wink


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