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smarauder68

Money drying up

Looking at the TDF cash standings(table):

Tour de France team cash standings:

1, BMC Racing Team 493,990 euro
2, Leopard Trek 395,310
3, Europcar 147,130
4, Garmin-Cervelo 145,940
5, HTC Highroad 104,940
6, Omega Pharma Lotto 96,600
7, FDJ 90,660
8, Euskaltel Euskadi 87,780
9, Saxo Bank SunGard 72,290
10, Sky Procycling 67,000
11, Movistar 46,660
12, AG2R La Mondiale 45,560
13, Cofidis 41,740
14, Vacansoleil DCM 35,650
15, Lampre ISD 30,100
16, Saur-Sojasun 26,930
17, Rabobank 24,290
18, Liquigas Cannondale 22,360
19, Quick Step 19,940
20, Katusha 12,380
21, Astana 11,710
22, RadioShack 10,540

I would have thought there was much more going out to the winners...That's a shockingly small amount for 9 guys to split for the biggest race of the year.
HuwB

A popular misconception that the Tour has big prize money.
2010 Tour of California winner Michael Rogers got just $21,000
10th place prize, this year was some daft figure, about $400, I think.

BMC get about $60,000 a man, which is pretty good for the average domestique.
True, $1500 isn't a lot for 3 weeks work, for the like of Levi and Kloden, though!

If you want to get rich, don't become a pro cyclist. Wink
Nolte

i think the standard division is 90% to the riders and 10% to the mechanics and other back up staff.
smarauder68

Don't most riders have an annual contract too?
HuwB

smarauder68 wrote:
Don't most riders have an annual contract too?


Sure, but fixed minimum wage for a domestique isn't great. Top of the pile being a PT rider. I think base wage is around $45,000 PA.
Of course, it goes up, for established riders, but only the very top guys get anything approaching a what could be described as a reasonable, pro sports salary.
ullrichfan

Those are almost certainly not a definitive set of figures.  Remember team leaders, and other riders, often split the money they get for stages wins with the team.  Cadel will likely give a percentage of his winnings to the team and I'm sure Cav will as well for all the help from his lead-out.
Mrs John Murphy

Well by my reckoning Levi only made $1000 for being gutless. No wonder he spends his time selling off bikes.
Biosphere

Re: Money drying up

smarauder68 wrote:
Looking at the TDF cash standings(table):

Tour de France team cash standings:

1, BMC Racing Team 493,990 euro
2, Leopard Trek 395,310
3, Europcar 147,130
4, Garmin-Cervelo 145,940
5, HTC Highroad 104,940
6, Omega Pharma Lotto 96,600
7, FDJ 90,660
8, Euskaltel Euskadi 87,780
9, Saxo Bank SunGard 72,290
10, Sky Procycling 67,000
11, Movistar 46,660
12, AG2R La Mondiale 45,560
13, Cofidis 41,740
14, Vacansoleil DCM 35,650
15, Lampre ISD 30,100
16, Saur-Sojasun 26,930
17, Rabobank 24,290
18, Liquigas Cannondale 22,360
19, Quick Step 19,940
20, Katusha 12,380
21, Astana 11,710
22, RadioShack 10,540

I would have thought there was much more going out to the winners...That's a shockingly small amount for 9 guys to split for the biggest race of the year.


Although that is indeed the 'prize' money, it's a selective set of figures when you get down to the lower teams. There's a start bonus of 51,243 per team and a finish bonus too if you have enough riders finishing. Very significant for most of the teams. The age old question about why do riders persist in going in breaks when they have 1% chance of success looks a bit different when the cash aspect is taken into account. FDJ win more than Saxo - Roy's aggression was a nice little earner.



UF wrote:
Those are almost certainly not a definitive set of figures.  Remember team leaders, and other riders, often split the money they get for stages wins with the team.  Cadel will likely give a percentage of his winnings to the team and I'm sure Cav will as well for all the help from his lead-out.


I thought it was always the case that the prize money was divided up equally cos the team leader has his good salary and endorsements etc. Well that's what I read in the papers when Stephen Roche won (or maybe Jimmy Magee said it on the TV), so I may be out of date now or even wrong then* Laughing

I also heard during this Tour that there can be arrangements in the break to just share the intermediates amongst themselves, hence why there is no contest sometimes and they just carry on working together.

* "Ardiles strokes the ball like it was a part of his anatomy." – a typical Magee gaffe during the World Cup.
"And there it is, the international symbol of peace – the pigeon!" – another Magee clanger during the Olympic Games opening ceremony.
Bartali

HuwB wrote:
True, $1500 isn't a lot for 3 weeks work, for the like of Levi and Kloden, though!


To be fair, most of the Radioshack boys didn't do three weeks work! Wink
Fontfroide

Don't know the figures, or whether they just get a few pair of shoes or some extra Oakleys, but many riders also have contracts with suppliers of stuff.  Some of them get their bikes too, which a few give to charities, but some just sell.  

In any case, it is true you don't get the kind of money other pro sports get.  Even the top guys get peanuts compared to the top guys in other sports.  Mind you, I doubt if any of them feel terribly poor.  Thing is, they are the very best in a global sport.  Top guys, more than one on some teams, make over a million according to what I read today in L'Equipe.

Its only peanuts when compared to the insane pay that football players get, or bankers, or other grossly rich people.  

As I understand it, the splitting of prize money is left over from an era when the contracts, annual pay was totally ridiculous.
Guiness

Fontfroide wrote:

Its only peanuts when compared to the insane pay that football players get, or bankers, or other grossly rich people.  

As I understand it, the splitting of prize money is left over from an era when the contracts, annual pay was totally ridiculous.


Spot on. Have a look at this http://www.cyclingtipsblog.com/2010/11/how-much-do-pro-cyclists-make/

Cycling doesn't pay a lot in consideration to other sports. I was reading that after the 2004 Olympics, Bradley Wiggins signed with Credit Agricole for £45,000 a year and this is a derisory amount for an Olympic champion. Dario Pieri, who came second in 2003  in Paris-Roubaix I think is now working with his father installing window frames after working in a garden center.

Some former cyclists do get lucky and get jobs as directeur sportiffs, spokesman for the teams, tv work but these positions are limited to a select few. Others open up their own bike shops/branded bike! Didn't De Luca start that?

Women pro cyclists probably suffer even more. Mrs G can probably say a bit on this topic.
SlowRower

Guiness wrote:
...Bradley Wiggins signed with Credit Agricole for £45,000 a year...


Little wonder that Wiggo jumped ship from Garmin when Sky offered ~£4m for 4 years.

Rowers earn even less than cyclists, with even double Olympic champions such as Steve Williams surviving on lottery funding and the odd fee for "motivational" speaking sessions. Even this is an improvement from the 80s and 90s - Steve Redgrave was largely bankrolled by his parents and then his wife up to the Atlanta OGs, from which he returned with a 4th gold medal and a massive overdraft!

Still, no-one forces any pro sportsman to do what they do. I guess the journeymen pro or semi-pro cyclists give up in their early to mid 20s when they realise they'll never earn more than peanuts, at which point they've still got a full life to enjoy and memories that most of us would kill for! Or else they carry on because it's better than the alternatives.
Biosphere

SlowRower wrote:
Guiness wrote:
...Bradley Wiggins signed with Credit Agricole for £45,000 a year...


Little wonder that Wiggo jumped ship from Garmin when Sky offered ~£4m for 4 years.

Rowers earn even less than cyclists, with even double Olympic champions such as Steve Williams surviving on lottery funding and the odd fee for "motivational" speaking sessions. Even this is an improvement from the 80s and 90s - Steve Redgrave was largely bankrolled by his parents and then his wife up to the Atlanta OGs, from which he returned with a 4th gold medal and a massive overdraft!

Still, no-one forces any pro sportsman to do what they do. I guess the journeymen pro or semi-pro cyclists give up in their early to mid 20s when they realise they'll never earn more than peanuts, at which point they've still got a full life to enjoy and memories that most of us would kill for! Or else they carry on because it's better than the alternatives.


Wiggins was no where near being a team leader Cofidis so 45k doesn't seem bad to me in the circumstances. I know he was an Olympic champion but that skill didn't really transfer over for him to the road (as a prologue specialist at the time). I think it was in 2007 after the Tour he was commenting about trying to get a pay rise out of Cofidis and them saying that he didn't win the prologue or the Albi ITT so it was hard for them justify a pay rise and him countering with what do you want me to do - cheat to win? I could understand both points of view.

Here in Italy, graduates I work with in their mid twenties are taking home 1k to 1.5k euro a month and that's with a masters in subjects like maths and physics. And they're on contracts, so have no long term job security. If you're nuts about cycling and you're not the academic type then it's probably not a bad choice if you can make it in to a top team and earn that kind of money in 20s and 30s. Big downside is trying to start a 2nd career approaching 40s.
Guiness

Biosphere wrote:

If you're nuts about cycling and you're not the academic type then it's probably not a bad choice if you can make it in to a top team and earn that kind of money in 20s and 30s. Big downside is trying to start a 2nd career approaching 40s.


Even tougher if they didn't finish their education so nothing to fall back on in their 40s... though I understand a good few cyclists do study part time while racing for 6 hours a day. Something I could not manage.

As some of you know I'm now a part-time teacher and one thing I do tell the kids is to get an education behind them - even if their talents lie elsewhere. You'll need it one day post the glory of being a sportsman.

When you reach, oh, about the age Lance is, wins start getting fewer and further between. When you can't win anymore, you stop being a pro racer. Then you can hope to get a coaching, trainer, or other team job, or you can hit the bricks and try to get a real job. Pension?  Laughing  If you were good enough and smart enough, you'd saved and invested and networked so that you can find a job or go back to school to train for a new career.
Bartali

Biosphere wrote:
Wiggins was no where near being a team leader Cofidis so 45k doesn't seem bad to me in the circumstances. I know he was an Olympic champion but that skill didn't really transfer over for him to the road (as a prologue specialist at the time). I think it was in 2007 after the Tour he was commenting about trying to get a pay rise out of Cofidis and them saying that he didn't win the prologue or the Albi ITT so it was hard for them justify a pay rise and him countering with what do you want me to do - cheat to win? I could understand both points of view.
 Wasn't this the time he said "anyone can win a stage in a GT".  Well he finally made it in 2010!  Good lad!
Severo

The post-career stuff would, in an ideal world, be helped by a decent riders' association - the lack of which we bemoan quite often. I know that the Professional Footballers' Association does a lot of work for the lower professionals, who generally earn pretty decent money but not enough so that they won't have to work again. All about recognizing you have a limited career, and training to do something else before you retire.
Guiness

Severo wrote:
All about recognizing you have a limited career, and training to do something else before you retire.


Exactly.
Beasley

Re: Money drying up

Biosphere wrote:
UF wrote:
Those are almost certainly not a definitive set of figures.  Remember team leaders, and other riders, often split the money they get for stages wins with the team.  Cadel will likely give a percentage of his winnings to the team and I'm sure Cav will as well for all the help from his lead-out.


I thought it was always the case that the prize money was divided up equally cos the team leader has his good salary and endorsements etc. Well that's what I read in the papers when Stephen Roche won (or maybe Jimmy Magee said it on the TV), so I may be out of date now or even wrong then* Laughing.

I doubt Cadel will see any of his E450,000.

From what I understand, it's not uncommon for the winner to waive his portion of prize money altogether, either distributing it throughout the team or buying gifts.

A generous act, but not much of a financial burden: the winner of the GC can usually demand E50,000 (sometimes more) for participating in a post-Tour criterium...

Do 3-4 and he's laughing.
Nolte

Re: Money drying up

Beasley wrote:
Biosphere wrote:
UF wrote:
Those are almost certainly not a definitive set of figures.  Remember team leaders, and other riders, often split the money they get for stages wins with the team.  Cadel will likely give a percentage of his winnings to the team and I'm sure Cav will as well for all the help from his lead-out.


I thought it was always the case that the prize money was divided up equally cos the team leader has his good salary and endorsements etc. Well that's what I read in the papers when Stephen Roche won (or maybe Jimmy Magee said it on the TV), so I may be out of date now or even wrong then* Laughing.

I doubt Cadel will see any of his E450,000.

From what I understand, it's not uncommon for the winner to waive his portion of prize money altogether, either distributing it throughout the team or buying gifts.

A generous act, but not much of a financial burden: the winner of the GC can usually demand E50,000 (sometimes more) for participating in a post-Tour criterium...

Do 3-4 and he's laughing.


and then their's probably a bonus written in his own contract for winning the tour and he can demand additional salary in future years
Guiness

Good point Nolte.
gerry12ie

Re: Money drying up

Biosphere wrote:


I thought it was always the case that the prize money was divided up equally cos the team leader has his good salary and endorsements etc. Well that's what I read in the papers when Stephen Roche won (or maybe Jimmy Magee said it on the TV), so I may be out of date now or even wrong then* Laughing

I also heard during this Tour that there can be arrangements in the break to just share the intermediates amongst themselves, hence why there is no contest sometimes and they just carry on working together.

* "Ardiles strokes the ball like it was a part of his anatomy." – a typical Magee gaffe during the World Cup.
"And there it is, the international symbol of peace – the pigeon!" – another Magee clanger during the Olympic Games opening ceremony.


Only noticed this thread now, and Jimmy Magee gems.  Do you recall his commentary from the TDF in 87 when trying to describe the size of a col and he equated it to 'Carrauntoohil on top of Carrauntoohil with half of Carrauntoohil again'.  Carrauntoohil is Ireland's highest peak...
Biosphere

Re: Money drying up

gerry12ie wrote:
Biosphere wrote:


I thought it was always the case that the prize money was divided up equally cos the team leader has his good salary and endorsements etc. Well that's what I read in the papers when Stephen Roche won (or maybe Jimmy Magee said it on the TV), so I may be out of date now or even wrong then* Laughing

I also heard during this Tour that there can be arrangements in the break to just share the intermediates amongst themselves, hence why there is no contest sometimes and they just carry on working together.

* "Ardiles strokes the ball like it was a part of his anatomy." – a typical Magee gaffe during the World Cup.
"And there it is, the international symbol of peace – the pigeon!" – another Magee clanger during the Olympic Games opening ceremony.


Only noticed this thread now, and Jimmy Magee gems.  Do you recall his commentary from the TDF in 87 when trying to describe the size of a col and he equated it to 'Carrauntoohil on top of Carrauntoohil with half of Carrauntoohil again'.  Carrauntoohil is Ireland's highest peak...


I don't remember that, but it sounds reasonably cogent for RTE in the 1980s. He was hilarious a few years back when he shared the revived Tour of Ireland with Liggett. Shouldn't have been allowed near a mike then, but after Unibet wrapped it up on Stage 1, he made the rest of the week worth tuning in for, bearing in mind that I was living in England and it gave me an excuse to get nostalgic Smile

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