Archive for justcycling.myfastforum.org Just Cycling
 


       justcycling.myfastforum.org Forum Index -> Cycling Forum
gerry12ie

Liège-Bastogne-Liège Sunday April 26th

AG2R La Mondiale
Domenico Pozzovivo, Jan Bakelants, Rinaldo Nocentini, Matteo Montaguti, Romain Bardet, Carlos Betancur, Mikael Cherel, Sébastien Minard

Astana Pro Team
Vincenzo Nibali, Fabio Aru, Alessandro Vanotti, Luis León Sánchez, Jakob Fuglsang, Rein Taaramäe , Andriy Grivko, Michele Scarponi

BMC Racing Team
Philippe Gilbert, Tejay Van Garderen, Samuel Sánchez , Ben Hermans, Brent Bookwalter, Klaas Lodewyck, Joey Rosskopf, Dylan Teuns

Cannondale – Garmin
Tom-Jelte Slagter, Daniel Martin, Alex Howes, Sebastian Langeveld, Davide Formolo, Nathan Haas, Edward King, Matej Mohoric

Etixx – Quick Step
Michal Kwiatkowski, Julian Alaphilippe, Maxime Bouet, Petr Vakoc, Gianluca Brambilla, Julien Vermote, Michal Golas, Zdenek Stybar

FDJ
Benoit Vaugrenard, Arthur Vichot, Laurent Pichon, Arnold Jeannesson, Kévin Réza , Anthony Roux, Jussi Veikkanen, Olivier Le Gac

Giant – Alpecin
Warren Barguil, Tom Dumoulin, Lawson Craddock, Caleb Fairly, Johannes Frohlinger, Simon Geschke, Thierry Hupond, Georg Preidler

IAM Cycling
Jarlinson Pantano, David Tanner, Mathias Frank, Clément Chevrier, Patrick Schelling, Pirmin Lang, Sebastien Reichenbach, Larry Warbasse

Lampre – Merida
Rui Costa, Matteo Bono, Diego Ulissi, Rafael Valls, Valerio Conti, Manuele Mori, Jan Polanc, José Serpa

Lotto Soudal
Tim Wellens, Jelle Vanendert, Tony Gallopin, Sander Armée , Bart de Clercq, Tosh Van Der Sande, Dennis Vanendert, Louis Vervaeke

LottoNL-Jumbo
Wilco Kelderman, Paul Martens, Bert-Jan Lindeman, Bram Tankink, Jos van Emden, Laurens ten Dam, Moreno Hofland, Mike Teunissen

Movistar Team
Nairo Quintana, Alejandro Valverde, Imanol Erviti, Giovanni Visconti, José Herrada, Gorka Izagirre, José Joaquin Rojas, Rory Sutherland

Orica GreenEDGE
Simon Gerrans, Johan Esteban Chaves, Michael Albasini, Simon Clarke, Luke Durbridge, Daryl Impey, Pieter Weening, Simon Yates

Team Katusha
Joaquim Rodriguez, Daniel Moreno, Giampaolo Caruso, Tiago Machado, Dmitry Kozontchuk, Sergey Lagutin, Alberto Losada, Maxim Belkov

Team Sky
Lars Petter Nordhaug, Nicolas Roche, Luis Sergio Henao, Philip Deignan, Nathan Earle, Vasil Kiryienka, Danny Pate, Kanstantsin Siutsou

Tinkoff – Saxo
Pawel Poljanski, Bruno Pires, Robert Kišerlovski , Michael Valgren, Rafał Majka, Chris Anker Sørensen, Roman Kreuziger, Manuele Boaro

Trek Factory Racing
Julián Arredondo, Bauke Mollema, Fränk Schleck, Fabio Felline, Laurent Didier, Bob Jungels, Calvin Watson, Fumiyuki Beppu

Procontinental teams

Bora-Argon 18
Patrick Konrad, José Mendes, Cesare Benedetti, Emanuel Buchmann, Bartosz Huzarski, Dominik Nerz, Bjorn Thurau, Paul Voss

Cofidis, Solutions Crédits
Anthony Turgis, Ángel Luis Maté , Yoann Bagot, Nicolas Edet, Romain Hardy, Rudy Molard, Stephane Rossetto, Julien Simon

Cult Energy Pro Cycling
Linus Gerdemann, Rasmus Guldhammer, Fabian Wegmann, Christian Mager, Romain Lemarchand, Michael Reihs, Martin Mortensen, Alex Kirsch

MTN – Qhubeka
Jacques J. v. Rensburg, Stephen Cummings, Andreas Stauff, Daniel Teklehaimanot, Matthew Brammeier, Louis Meintjes, Merhawi Kudus, Johann Van Zyl

Team Europcar
Pierre Rolland, Yukiya Arashiro, Maxime Mederel, Bryan Nauleau, Perrig Quemeneur, Angelo Tulik, Thomas Voeckler, Fabrice Jeandesboz

Team Roompot Oranje Peloton
Johnny Hoogerland, Michel Kreder, Maurits Lammertink, Huub Duyn, Sjoerd van Ginneken, Reinier Honig, Marc de Maar, Mike Terpstra

Topsport Vlaanderen – Baloise
Floris De Tier, Thomas Sprengers, Preben Van Hecke, Arthur Vanoverberghe, Pieter Vanspeybrouck, Sander Helven, Otto Vergaerde, Tim Declercq

Wanty – Groupe Gobert
Enrico Gasparotto, Jerome Baugnies, Francis De Greef, Yannick Eijssen, Marco Minnaard, Bjorn Leukemans, Tim De Troyer, Simone Antonini







Can Dan and the Panda stop Valverde?

https://www.facebook.com/danmartinofficial/videos/451151268382136/
Nolte

with the panda's help, come on dan Smile
Mrs John Murphy

Aru from Piti in the 2015 Vinokurov FU to Anti-Doping Memorial Race. Wink
gerry12ie

So, live now on ES.  Small break with Ulissi has just a few seconds.  It's difficult to see this race bucking the Monument trend of recent years for increasingly bigger groups approaching the finish.  The weather looks perfect so I'm expecting an even bigger bunch than last year to reach the finale.

Will it affect the outcome?  Probably not...
Nolte

its looking an active race so far which will hopefully mean that its more broken up at the finish.
Bartali

Hope so ....
Fontfroide

Just tuned in.  Two Astanas up front in the break.  Two more in front of the peloton.  Hmmm, maybe Nibali plans an attack from afar.  Wink
mr shifter

gerry12ie wrote:
 It's difficult to see this race bucking the Monument trend of recent years for increasingly bigger groups approaching the finish.  
Teams spend more time and money by jointly training together.
Domestics are much fitter than past years with the selections and testing they now do.
The finishing km's of L-B-L (and other monuments) are much harder than years ago, in the hope of whittling down the peloton.
Nolte

crash involving lots of riders across both sides of the road including dan martin, nicholas roche. Europcar rider does not look good either
Biosphere

Nolte wrote:
crash involving lots of riders across both sides of the road including dan martin, nicholas roche. Europcar rider does not look good either


Both of them moving now. Nibali was on the fringes of it but escaped.
Biosphere

Gerrans on the ground for the second time. His rear mech was buggered.
Fontfroide

Vincenzo now at the front, ready to pounce.
Nolte

Biosphere wrote:
Nolte wrote:
crash involving lots of riders across both sides of the road including dan martin, nicholas roche. Europcar rider does not look good either


Both of them moving now. Nibali was on the fringes of it but escaped.


i really think roche and martin both need stabilisers, although i have the same view of deignan, but they always seem to crash in races where they both go to.
ventoux

Nolte wrote:
crash involving lots of riders across both sides of the road including dan martin....

How's the panda getting on?  Confused
Fontfroide

Pissing with rain at the finish, interrupting transmission and making opportunities.  Nibali loves the rain.
Biosphere

Nolte wrote:
Biosphere wrote:
Nolte wrote:
crash involving lots of riders across both sides of the road including dan martin, nicholas roche. Europcar rider does not look good either


Both of them moving now. Nibali was on the fringes of it but escaped.


i really think roche and martin both need stabilisers, although i have the same view of deignan, but they always seem to crash in races where they both go to.


Maybe I'm mis-remembering but Martin seems to be in a class of his own.

The video feed is breaking up more often than a dodgy web stream.
Fontfroide

Who is the Sky director or worker with the blonde ponytail?
mr shifter

Oh Claudy (Claude Criquielion) where are you.
You would never have let them ride La Redoute at that snails pace.
You would have been gone.  (I know you didn't win, but you had no team)

When will they start to race today. ????
mr shifter

Fontfroide wrote:
 Nibali loves the rain.

Should be OK coming down from St Nicks, then.  Rolling Eyes
Biosphere

mr shifter wrote:
When will they start to race today. ????


Last km?

It's a gruppo compatto for now.
gerry12ie

A post-feed (involuntary) nap meant I missed the crash.  Still plenty of riders in play, though.  Valverde still the red hot favourite for me...
Nolte

Biosphere wrote:
Nolte wrote:
Biosphere wrote:
Nolte wrote:
crash involving lots of riders across both sides of the road including dan martin, nicholas roche. Europcar rider does not look good either


Both of them moving now. Nibali was on the fringes of it but escaped.


i really think roche and martin both need stabilisers, although i have the same view of deignan, but they always seem to crash in races where they both go to.


Maybe I'm mis-remembering but Martin seems to be in a class of his own.


i think you're right on dan.

ventoux wrote:
Nolte wrote:
crash involving lots of riders across both sides of the road including dan martin....

How's the panda getting on?  Confused


maybe next year, the panda will enlist other friends to line the route with warnings for dan :d
Fontfroide

I thought Nibali had to make a move today.  I appear to be impatient.  Still ...
Nolte

kreuziger attacks, gianpaolo caruso follows.
Biosphere

And now the rain has started and Fuglsang has attacked too. Finalamente as the man on my TV says.
ventoux

Fontfroide wrote:
I thought Nibali had to make a move today.  I appear to be impatient.  Still ...


Nibali seems to find the classics a less stressful experience than winning Grand Tours. “It’s completely different to a Grand Tour here,” he said. “You need a bit of invention, a bit of ingenuity and experience, as well as the luck to find the perfect day.....

so where is it then?
Biosphere

ventoux wrote:
Fontfroide wrote:
I thought Nibali had to make a move today.  I appear to be impatient.  Still ...


Nibali seems to find the classics a less stressful experience than winning Grand Tours. “It’s completely different to a Grand Tour here,” he said. “You need a bit of invention, a bit of ingenuity and experience, as well as the luck to find the perfect day.....

so where is it then?


Right about now Wink
Fontfroide

Someone will show creativity and initiative before the last slight incline, no?
gerry12ie

Hatch and Kelly the dream team.  Here's the weather...
Fontfroide

Who exactly is chasing, seems kind of random to me?
gerry12ie

The only thing you need to know is that Valverde hasn't turned a pedal yet...
Nolte

stybar putting in tough turns, but he's getting little help and valverde in second wheel with katusha rider third wheel preventing more coming up while caruso skipping turns up front.
Biosphere

My Italian flavoured TV was telling how St. Nicks is a street of Italian immigrants and Nibali would do something. I don't think going backwards was what they had in mind.
Fontfroide

Biosphere wrote:
My Italian flavoured TV was telling how St. Nicks is a street of Italian immigrants and Nibali would do something. I don't think going backwards was what they had in mind.


Me neither.  Oh well.  Lots of guys dropped on the last hill.  One knew that didn't one?
Bartali

Nibali popped on the St Nicholas ... oh hum.
Biosphere

Katusha have the numbers.
Fontfroide

Some frogs still in it!
ventoux

gerry12ie wrote:
The only thing you need to know is that Valverde hasn't turned a pedal yet...


Very Happy
gerry12ie

Huw, who said them hilly classics were predictable? Very Happy In horse racing parlance Valverde was pulling double in the final (and for the whole race actually).  I like this Alaphilippe though Wink
Fontfroide

Shoulda stuck with Valverde.  Who could guess he could do second first first?

Alaphilippe now the great white French hope in the hilly classics... about time.

AG2R seems well set up too.  Allez les Bleus.
Nolte

i think alaphilippe came from a little bit too far back for the final sprint.
Biosphere

Alaphilippe could have positioned himself better - might have just shaded it given that Valverde is not the sharpest of sprinters these days. At first I was wondering if they were just going to let Moreno ride away with it.
Fontfroide

Nolte wrote:
i think alaphilippe came from a little bit too far back for the final sprint.


Seems like a textbook illustration of lack of experience and experience.  Stunning how the old wise guys have that hunch of when to go and when to leave it.  

No doubt Alaphilippe will have another day.  I figure he will be in the headline of an article in l'Equipe tomorrow, especially with Bardet in sixth.  The French are coming back strongly at all levels.

It take a bit of time for things to get going, non?
gerry12ie

Biosphere wrote:
Alaphilippe could have positioned himself better - might have just shaded it given that Valverde is not the sharpest of sprinters these days. At first I was wondering if they were just going to let Moreno ride away with it.


I thought so too, but maybe Piti didn't want to trip too many sensors by chasing Moreno down immediately  Wink
gerry12ie

Arguably a better hilly classics campaign for Etixx than the cobbled season... Nice super-dom stint from Stybar at the end there, as it became clear quite quickly that Alaphilippe rather than Flower was going to be the main man.
mr shifter

Bartali wrote:
Nibali popped on the St Nicholas ... oh hum.

He got to the railway bridge and tried his luck.
I moaned "I hope your fit my boy" as that is too early and the place it's steepest is where to attack on the bends where the Flats (apartments) are.
Valverde has the know how & experience to play the right notes at the right time.
Again - 2006 - 2008 - 2015.

He joins 3 other riders on 3 wins.
gerry12ie

Is that not Valverde's third win, Shifter? Vino bought it in 2010, non?
Bartali

gerry12ie wrote:
The only thing you need to know is that Valverde hasn't turned a pedal yet...


Aint that the truth ... he really is rather good at these sorts of finishes!
mr shifter

gerry12ie wrote:
Is that not Valverde's third win, Shifter? Vino bought it in 2010, non?
Sorry about that.
Too many Alexanders.  Embarassed
mr shifter

Biosphere wrote:
At first I was wondering if they were just going to let Moreno ride away with it.

Memories of Tony Rominger riding away on Ans Hill (first time up there) and then an unbelievable Rolf Sorensen clawing his way to him.
Tony's comment that when he was caught, he knew it was lost because of a better sprinter.
On reflection it was the early days of Conconi but still memorable.
The finish in those early days went straight across the junction (where they turn left now) to do 2/3 km's around Ans.
mr shifter

A puzzle has entered my mind.
With so many Italians in the neibourhood of the climb up to Saint-Nicolas then I would have thought he might have contacted the Italian Association there to spend a couple of days on that hill.
It would make their day.  scratch
Boogerd_Fan

well, that was all a bit predictable wasn't it.
HuwB

Boogerd_Fan wrote:
well, that was all a bit predictable wasn't it.


Sunday catch up again.

As long as these boys have a sprint kick, it's always going to be.
Teams (some) are so strong.
Long attacks that stick are a thing of the past. Sad
Bartali

Radios radios radios ..... that's the difference Huw.
Boogerd_Fan

the Katusha tactic of sending MOreno up the road and letting Valv bring him back was fine.. but JRod isn't 30 years old anymore. He didnt have it to come around Valverde once they caught Moreno.
Biosphere

mr shifter wrote:
A puzzle has entered my mind.
With so many Italians in the neibourhood of the climb up to Saint-Nicolas then I would have thought he might have contacted the Italian Association there to spend a couple of days on that hill.
It would make their day.  scratch


Not sure a meet and greet would have made much difference to the state of his legs, but for sure it would have made the local's day? I take the TV commentator at face value that there are lots of Italian in the area, but I suppose it's fairly accurate as he was commentating in Italian.

Bartali wrote:
Radios radios radios ..... that's the difference Huw.


Not sure radios make much difference on a day like today where the course is well known, ridden every year (I know there are some changes) and the teams have a strategy. It was fairly likely to come down the way it did. I think it's more to do with more and more riders being capable of sticking the distance and the profile in a way that wasn't true in the past. Riders have better kit (e.g. power meters are pretty universal now) and are better trained whilst the route doesn't change so much. To go completely off topic, Eau Rouge in F1 was a legendary corner that separated the men from the boys. However, now the cars are so good they can all pretty much take it flat out and it's not what it was.

Boogerd_Fan wrote:
the Katusha tactic of sending MOreno up the road and letting Valv bring him back was fine.. but JRod isn't 30 years old anymore. He didnt have it to come around Valverde once they caught Moreno.


When he started coming around him, I though we were maybe going to see pay back for Florence, but the tight camera angle had obscured that there wasn't much climb left and he had company anyway.
Bartali

Nibali got caught up in the crash and had to chase on which might explain the lack of fire power on St Nick.

As for radios, all you says true Bio.  But without the radios, they don't know whether the brake is 2, 3 or 4 minutes away - and that makes the race very different from 80km out. Don't think what Sunday would be without radio ... it would have been an unrecognisable race IMO.  All the tactics would be different.
Biosphere

Bartali wrote:
. . .   But without the radios, they don't know whether the brake is 2, 3 or 4 minutes away - and that makes the race very different from 80km out. Don't think what Sunday would be without radio ... it would have been an unrecognisable race IMO.  All the tactics would be different.


But surely we don't do away with the men on bikes with time gaps?

And if you do the teams will have spotters at the side of the road . . .  the feed bags will have a note with the time gaps . . .  the DS is watching TV is the car and gets the time gaps during the ad breaks in Game of Thrones Wink And so on . . .
Bartali

Yup ... twas alway the way, but it isn't that reliable.  Got to go ... GoT is back on Wink
gerry12ie

There was a snippet yesterday on ES of Saxo doing a recon in the Ardennes.  At one stage I overheard Yeats advising a rider(s) to more or less 'stay up the front, but not on the front, don't work too hard and stay out of trouble'.  It struck me that what he said was more or less what I was told when I was racing at 16 years of age, what my missus was told before her first race many years later, and what riders all over will be told for the next number of years to come.  The point is, cycle racing isn't really a tactical masterclass and it is rare to see a race deviate too much from the predicted outcome, and yesterday was a perfect case in point.

However, while Bio's points are perfectly valid, I still agree with Bartali on the radio issue - and the reason why it would produce a better finale without radios is the very one-dimensionality that Yeats' instructions highlight.  Time and again in non-WT races innocous attacks spark up a race and quickly lead to 3 or 4 groups or more strung along the road, all because the guys behind don't want to miss out on the action.  For any Monument or most WT stage races now you could safely tune out for all but the last 20k, but a days racing without  radios is a much more watchable affair IMO.  I reckon if you gave them the chance to race, most of them would take it and while it might not affect the overall results too much it would certainly be easier on the eye...

I thought the radio issue was meant to be on the agenda for 2015, or did Cookson bin that?

http://inrng.com/2014/12/race-radios-banned-2015/
gerry12ie

Bartali wrote:
Yup ... twas alway the way, but it isn't that reliable.  Got to go ... GoT is back on Wink


Did you not watch the first four episodes on the bounce a couple of weeks ago? Wink I wish I didn't because I have been twiddling my thumbs since...
Biosphere

gerry12ie wrote:
Bartali wrote:
Yup ... twas alway the way, but it isn't that reliable.  Got to go ... GoT is back on Wink


Did you not watch the first four episodes on the bounce a couple of weeks ago? Wink I wish I didn't because I have been twiddling my thumbs since...


In keeping with his cherishing of the old school, Bart's country manor is on dial up Wink
HuwB

Some teams are just too strong. Cut them from 9 to 6 or7.
Over 250kms, they run out of troops before the final climb and you get..............action.
Bartali

Dial up ... I'm recording them on Betamax!

Gerry / Huw - agreed as per usual
Biosphere

HuwB wrote:
Some teams are just too strong. Cut them from 9 to 6 or7.
Over 250kms, they run out of troops before the final climb and you get..............action.


I think that would ultimately be more effective for the 1 day races. As I tried to say above too many riders are getting to the finish and leading to a more controlled race.
Nolte

Biosphere wrote:
HuwB wrote:
Some teams are just too strong. Cut them from 9 to 6 or7.
Over 250kms, they run out of troops before the final climb and you get..............action.


I think that would ultimately be more effective for the 1 day races. As I tried to say above too many riders are getting to the finish and leading to a more controlled race.


and there is also talk of reducing team sizes in total to 23 i think so reducing number of riders in a team for a race could be tied in to that.
Mrs John Murphy

Bartali wrote:
Dial up ... I'm recording them on Betamax!

Gerry / Huw - agreed as per usual


Don't you get the Butler to do it?

I'd have thought betamax was a bit modern for you? Don't you get the original reels delivered to you and then the servants handcrank the projector?

~~~

Ultimately - anything that makes the race less predictable is going to be resisted by the big, wealthy teams.
mr shifter

Nolte wrote:

and there is also talk of reducing team sizes in total to 23 i think so reducing number of riders in a team for a race could be tied in to that.

Difficult with the amount of UCI Pro Tour events they are contracted to ride.
Bartali

Mrs John Murphy wrote:


I'd have thought betamax was a bit modern for you? Don't you get the original reels delivered to you and then the servants handcrank the projector?
Very Happy  Very Happy
Nolte

mr shifter wrote:
Nolte wrote:

and there is also talk of reducing team sizes in total to 23 i think so reducing number of riders in a team for a race could be tied in to that.

Difficult with the amount of UCI Pro Tour events they are contracted to ride.


its part of the plan of a reduced calendar and reduced race days

Quote:
Streamlined calendar

There is also some consensus that the current calendar, which runs from January to October, is too long and overlaps during key parts of the season. The WorldTour opens in January with the Santos Tour Down Under, then goes into hibernation until March. And the most obvious example of overlap are Paris-Nice and Tirreno-Adriatico, which coincide in March. Races would also have a heavy “Sunday” focus to draw in TV viewers, and see no overlapping between the major races on the first- and second-tier calendars. A new, “third-division” calendar will be created from much of the leftovers, including major races in the current tours in Oceania, Africa, America, Europe, and Asia, which would race a similar schedule to what currently exists.
Reduced race days

The rough outline calls for 120 race days for the first division (compared to a current 153 WorldTour race days in 2014), and 50 race days for the second division. This would also mean some races would see a reduction in race days, with stage races, such as the Tour de Suisse or the Critérium du Dauphiné, possibly cut to five or six days. There’s even been some discussion of rolling back the Vuelta a España and Giro d’Italia to fewer than three weeks, though that seems unlikely after strong resistance from race organizers.

Read more at http://velonews.competitor.com/20...alized_353183#IjHspEoYacR7ggOu.99


another article is http://inrng.com/2014/03/uci-world-tour-reforms/

i think we previously posted a possible calendar for this. this was our original thread http://justcycling.myfastforum.org/ftopic5022-0.php

       justcycling.myfastforum.org Forum Index -> Cycling Forum
Page 1 of 1
Create your own free forum | Buy a domain to use with your forum