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Slapshot 3

ASO withdraws le Tour from World Tour Races for 2017

Will this be the story of 2016??

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/a...nce-from-2017-worldtour-calendar/
Fontfroide

I think that any of these guys who are involved, certainly all he ASO decision makers, should have compulsory drug tests, including surprise tests.

Pity if this is a big story.  I find myself so disinterested.  Maybe some of you can explain why this is important.  My only interpretation so far is a money grabbing power play by ASO.  But it could be a money grabbing power play by the UCI.  anyway any of it might make the sport better for us spectators.
Biosphere

Whilst I accept that it's up to ASO what to do with their own races, I can't imagine that 3 year licenses is really the problem here.

I had a look at the HC rules on the UCI page and a 1 day race is limited to 200km so what will ASO do with their Monuments? Equally, stage races are limited to 5 days so even more of a mismatch there on ASO's product. This doesn't seem to rate a mention on the various articles I've read so don't know if I'm misunderstanding something as surely it's a fairly obvious showstopper for ASO's plans. There is not much chance of them getting a UCI exemption I would have thought?
Fontfroide

The rules of the UCI could be amended to say that all HC races are limited to 200k, unless they are owned by ASO, then they can be any length and be HC and not be subject to UCI rules.  Let's see, who might gain in that case?  

Great story, kind of like a corporate takeover story on the business page.  Fortunately cycling is so low down the table of big money sports, so the battle might not be publicised as much as football or athletics.  No one will care except us.
mr shifter

I'm with the ASO as I don't want to see anymore Watered down races.
They have reduced too many already.

All this bollox about power struggles as it seems to me that the ASO is only trying to keep the historical standards.
Let the Organisers Organise and set the calendar for each continent with the UCI just dealing with their rules as they have no means or know how about organising the sport.

They hope to increase the calendar so as to fit more "Money" into their pockets. They have done this with the Track Racing programe and their many little meetings spread throughout the year.

Is that what you want to happen for the Road, by having more little races around the world.

This 3 year License is a product of the UCI and the ASO have already shown they can continue with organising races within the French Federation.
The whole of the French Federation could withdraw from the UCI and continue a racing programe with the support of their government.
Would they miss not taking part in a One Day World Championship. No I don't think so as they could play up the value of a Tri-Colour Jersey.
Boogerd_Fan

My thoughts are it won't matter too much as not many people are looking at the season-long narrative (what UCI want us to believe is in place already). UCI is totally powerless in this situation, are they going to state that if a rider is in the WorldTour they cannot race the Tour??!! They are not so powerful!

What could change things is if RCS/Giro folks join with ASO. We'd be at same point as when Protour was suggested, with the organizers threatening to take the biggest, best races into their own private league.

ASO can do that already with the monuments and TDF.. but if the other organizers get behind their initiative, it will only prove the UCI powerless... as usual.
Nolte

In terms of the giro, I guess it is fence sitting at the time as RCS has been put up for sale

http://bicyclingaustralia.com.au/news/for-sale-rcs-sports

So a big decision like this may not be made as future is unclear.
berck

Vaughters has chimed in with his opinion.
Tour owner ASO ‘is the big playground bully’
Fontfroide

But Berck, ASO is acting exactly like a playground bully.  They think they are the most important race owner on the calendar by far.  In this they are correct, they have no rivals worthy of note.  Even Velon is a pygmy compared to them.  They, like any bully, think they can do what they wish.  Most of the fans don't know or care who owns what race.  they just want to watch them all.  On TV if possible.

So I think Vaughters is basically right.  And has no strategy yet to counteract the power of the bully.  If the UCI, the teams, the owners, the riders or any decent combination of those actors cannot get themselves well organised, ASO can do whatever it wants.

I see nothing very positive about that.  Although they do organise races pretty effectively.  the Vaughters article mentioned some of the races owned by ASO, but to that list we can add ladies and Mens Qatar, Oman, Criterium International, Dauphine, Norway, L'Avenir, Paris Tours and World Ports Classic … plus loads of other sporting events.

They are "too big to fail", maybe.
berck

I agree with you FF.

One of the site admin's added to my post with their opinion, so everything starting with "JV's head.." are not my words. This was accidental.
Slapshot 3

berck wrote:
I agree with you FF.

One of the site admin's added to my post with their opinion, so everything starting with "JV's head.." are not my words. This was accidental.


Yeah..... this one!! plank!!! Rolling Eyes  Rolling Eyes  Rolling Eyes

JV's head is firmly up his own butt at the minute, he's had a go at Oleg as well about what he pays Contador. Now whether you like Oleg or not, would JV be whining like a baby if he'd managed to cajole Berto to signing for him a few years ago!!!
Bartali

I think Mr S hit the nail on the head earlier.  The ASO is a pretty effective race organiser and has a track record of doing its job well.  The UCI (and the teams) have a track record of, to put it bluntly, fucking up the sport.The ASO have modernised the sport in a proportionate way.  The UCI have destroyed race after race in an attempt to 'globalise' the sport.
Slapshot 3

Bartali wrote:
I think Mr S hit the nail on the head earlier.  The ASO is a pretty effective race organiser and has a track record of doing its job well.  The UCI (and the teams) have a track record of, to put it bluntly, fucking up the sport.The ASO have modernised the sport in a proportionate way.  The UCI have destroyed race after race in an attempt to 'globalise' the sport.


^^ This^^  salut  thumright
Biosphere

Can't see that ASO are angels in all of this. They were happy to welcome Armstrong back despite knowing full well he was a doper. Can't agree they were doing their job well in that era. Well I guess they were since the job is making dollars, but given that cycling's tarnished image is one of the oft cited reasons for problems in drawing in stable sponsors, their interests do not automatically align with wider interests.

And I don't see either that a few more Pro-Continental teams and a few less World Tour teams are going to improve the sporting quality of their races which is what they claim this is all about.

But yeah, it's their races and they can make their choices. Vaughters hasn't got a leg to stand on.
SlowRower

Boogerd_Fan wrote:
...it will only prove the UCI powerless... as usual.


There must be some issue here with the Olympics as the IOC will either deal with the UCI or won't bother with cycling at all. Olympic participation is a big draw for a lot of national federations, so a breakaway league is less likely than one may think.
HuwB

Biosphere wrote:
Can't see that ASO are angels in all of this. They were happy to welcome Armstrong back despite knowing full well he was a doper. Can't agree they were doing their job well in that era. Well I guess they were since the job is making dollars, but given that cycling's tarnished image is one of the oft cited reasons for problems in drawing in stable sponsors, their interests do not automatically align with wider interests.

And I don't see either that a few more Pro-Continental teams and a few less World Tour teams are going to improve the sporting quality of their races which is what they claim this is all about.

But yeah, it's their races and they can make their choices. Vaughters hasn't got a leg to stand on.


This, for me, too.

The UCI and ASO are pretty much cut from the same cloth.

The UCI may well have butchered a lot of races, in a (failed) attempt to tap into the potential multi million dollar markets that are China and the US.
However, the ASO (and RCS) have taped into the oil rich nations, while at the same time doing little at home to support financially strapped races.
Case in point, the ASO walked away from the Classique des Alpes, citing lack of rider/team interest.
Now, they expect teams to be clambering over one another to ride in far off lands, so as to get a TDF berth.
What changed?

Fact is they looked at the bottom line and pulled the plug.
Exactly what one would expect a commercial enterprise to do.

In Italy, with a less stable RCS, the situation is even worse, with half the calendar on the breadline or already gone under. Yet, they come up with a race in Abu Dhabi.

I don't see them as some kind of benevolent benefactor, watching over the future of the sport.
At the end of the day. the only thing they are watching over is the profits and loss column.
Nolte

Basically what huw and bio said.

What is the main cause of it is both organisations own self interest, rather than what is in cycling interest
gerry12ie

Well said Huw and Bio.  ASO are a purely commercial interest whose primary function is to generate interest and cash for the ASO - cycling is just the vehicle that they use to do that.  UCI have flogged the globalisation horse for pretty much the same reason.

Much remains to be seen, and at the moment it isn't much more than a power play IMO...
berck

gerry12ie wrote:
Well said Huw and Bio.  ASO are a purely commercial interest whose primary function is to generate interest and cash for the ASO - cycling is just the vehicle that they use to do that.  UCI have flogged the globalisation horse for pretty much the same reason.

Much remains to be seen, and at the moment it isn't much more than a power play IMO...


Yep. Exactly right.
mr shifter

gerry12ie wrote:

- cycling is just the vehicle that they use to do that.  

I think I have been banging that Drum in every post I have made on JC.


The profit and loss account seems (with all it's faults) to be successfull for them and for Pro Racing.
Have we had the full conclusions of this UCI mandate yet. ???
Maybe I.ve missed it.

All I have read for certain is that the ASO don't want to be part of this New World Tour.
From that I have given the possibility of how deep that statement could go if they pushed the French into a corner.

So will that statement have any influence on the final UCI mandate and cause the UCI into thoughts that I presented. (well they have enough staff in Agle to work it out)

We are all speculating the outcome and I do believe the UCI have been halted and delayed with their presentation.  scratch
kathy

My opinion - both UCI and ASO are in it for the money..

BUT, who is the more experienced and professional at organisation of races, in terms of TV coverage, getting sponsorship for races etc.  IMO, without doubt the ASO.
mr shifter

berck wrote:
gerry12ie wrote:
Well said Huw and Bio.  ASO are a purely commercial interest whose primary function is to generate interest and cash for the ASO - cycling is just the vehicle that they use to do that.  UCI have flogged the globalisation horse for pretty much the same reason.

Much remains to be seen, and at the moment it isn't much more than a power play IMO...
Yep. Exactly right.
Where has anybody mentioned the disruption by the UCI of the European Calendar which is my main concern with more piddling little races of 200 km's or little mini tours.
The whole European Calendar will eventually look like Tour of Poland , Britain, Eneco, Artic and Down Under,  
Within my time I have witnessed, among others the 4 Jour Dunklerque is now 5 not 6 days the Tour de Suisse is n ow 9 not 10 days ( and I can't say who did it, but the Dauphine is at least a day short)  
You couldn't fit the next Giro d'Italia into the old VUELTA calendar place which used to start 5 days after Liege, as the Giro will start next 6th May 2016 to 29th May.

The ASO are capable of organising these races and make money in any case within or even out of the WT and we all know they are commercial.

The Bully Boys are the UCI who are manipulating the calendar for their own ends.
Good luck to them as I won't be around to see the full effects of their plans and Eddy Merckx won't neither.
We both have witnessed the greatest days of cycling as you can look forward to roulers like Sagan winning all.
mr shifter

Post Tue Dec 29, 2015 1:55 pm  
Fontfroide wrote:

So I kind of meant that one day the UCI will wake up and realise they have lost the plot.  
That will be the day.
I thought that the departure of McQuid was the time to rearange the structure of the UCI but No it seems.

If you have ever seen the UK TV programe called "Yes Minister" you can see how the establishment (Civil Servants ??) who just carry on as each new "Elected Incumbent" arrives and is fed information to achieve the establishment's Strategic planning objectives that are outside the Elected Mandate.

So my point is :- That Cookson is just going with the Flow because he is not strong enough to take on the people in Agle who have set their stall out (under both the Fat Controllers) for a Global (money making) Enterprise. (maybe he agrees with it before he arived ?)
IMO- he's not doing very well.

It needs the Cycling fraternity to take action with their various Federations to get some democracy in the system to alter this status quo.

I think "Bully Boys" is the term that has been used.   Wink
mr shifter

NEWS
28.12.2015 @ 15:08 Posted by Emil Axelgaard

José Luis de Santos has been a professional rider, manager, national coach and is now the President of the Association of Professional Cyclists in Spain ACP. From his current position, he confirms that he shares views with Amaury Sport Organisation (ASO), organizer of the Tour de Franc,e in their decision to leave in 2017 WorldTour that will undergo a reform by the International Cycling Union (UCI).

BiciCiclismo has contacted De Santos (1968) to know more about his views on the battle between ASO and the UCI. Santos remains "optimistic" and believes that together the parties can reach "a deal in one way or another." He also defends the autonomy of his association and makes it clear that the international riders union CPA represents itself.

CPA president Gianni Bugno has criticized the UCI for failing to reach an agreement that included all the key stakeholders.  

”In addition to the lack of consensus among all the stakeholder in the process, we also think that any process about cycling reforms should maintain a lot of the values ​​that have made ​​this sport important,” he says. “That was one of the points where ASO did not agree and we share that view. The news is certainly not good; it is best to work together for a good reform that is good for all parties, riders, teams and organizers. We should all go forward hand in hand. But right now you can see that it's complicated.”

Santos does not believe that it will be possible to have a WorldTour without the Tour de France.

“It is not a question about whether it is possible or not. Another thing is that the interest is quickly called into question,” he says. “The Tour is the beacon of professional cycling and the highlight of the media interest. It will be difficult to explain this to the public.

We must be optimistic that a deal will be reached in one way or another. The reality is that cycling cannot have two parallel leagues. There is a lot of competition for media interest with other sports and this will only confuse the fans. Ideally, there will be consensus and a good solution. However, in reality there was no debate at the UCI seminar in Barcelona reality. No one said anything, it was decided quickly and then the Tour decided to leave the WorldTour.”

As always, the riders are caught in the middle of a war between the teams that support the reform, and the organizers.

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